Re: Sabayon 5.2_64 live disk installation.Brkn.Grub [Solved]

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Re: Sabayon 5.2_64 live disk installation.Brkn.Grub [Solved]

Postby onederer » Thu May 27, 2010 23:11

analyticalman wrote:Just so I understand - you are in PCLOS - its working fine but if you su to root and do grub-install /dev/hda (I would probably try it with and without the external disc connected) then assuming you boot from hda it doesn't install grub on your MBR is that right? Do you get error messages? If you don't it must be installing it somewhere!

Alternatively if you are in Sabayon and as root do

grub-mkconfig -o /boot/grub/grub.cfg Can you not make Sabayon pick up PCLOS? What does it list as it executes the command?


I haven't yet had the chance to try your command above. /drv/sda = Windows; /drv/sdb = PCLOS; /drv/sdc = Sabayon. I did try grub-install /dev/sdb without and with external SABAYON disconnected. I tried it twice! Once as /dev/sdb for the MBR, and the other for /dev/sdb1 for the first partition. No errors are reported. But when I boot up, all I get is "grub rescue>". It just doesn't take! And where it's depositing the results of that command, I have no idea.
I'll give you an update when I execute that last command that you presented me. Right now thanks to the SDG CDROM hybrid, I've been able to access everything from the box. But that still doesn't fix the PCLOS's botched Grub. How do I restore Linux's MBR? Maybe that would straighten out the problem, short of having to re-install from scratch PCLOS all over again. (YUCK!).

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Re: Sabayon 5.2_64 live disk installation.Brkn.Grub [Solved]

Postby onederer » Thu May 27, 2010 23:44

nickdanger wrote:Hope it is OK to add my comments:

I have a 64bit box with two SATA connected hard drives that are identical except for their serial numbers. I only load one OS per drive, and I switch between the two operating systems, by changing the boot device in the system BIOS settings at startup. Not sure if this is an "approved" method, but it has always worked. Usually one drive has my "Sabayon Stable Install" and the other has something I am experimenting with, like a "Sabayon Daily Release." For example, I had Sabayon 4.0 G-64, working on sda and I installed Sabayon 5.1 G-64 on sdb with no problems, and could switch between the drives when I booted the PC by entering the BIOS setup screen and selecting the drive I wanted to boot from. I must have done 15 fresh installs this way. When I installed Sabayon daily 5-8-2010 G-64, from DVD to sdb, it trashed my Grub on sda. This is not of great concern, because I rsync everything to my server, and nothing was lost, so i did not waste much time troubleshooting the bootloader. I used the 5-8-2010 daily release until the 5-22-2010 G-64 daily release was mirrored, and then I loaded it on to sda. I checked the previous version install on sdb and found that once again Grub was trashed. In each case, I verified the DVD burn against the MD5 posted. In each case, the installer displayed both sda, and sdb (including their unique serial numbers) as being available to be mounted, but I only selected the one drive I was installing to. The installer always picked the correct location to install the bootloader, so I went with the default both times.

Next install, I will disconnect the SATA cable for the unmounted drive, before doing a new install, because Anaconda must have a problem with the way I have my system set up. Now that I know about it, I can accommodate it easily.

Please do not read this as a complaint, I know exactly what "bleeding edge software" is, and I would not try it if I did not enthusiastically support your efforts. I just wanted to add what little information I could. If you need a pastebin of my hardware setup let me know.

N.D.


Although it is somewhat time consuming, the way you are selecting your boot drive, it's not a bad way to go. However, I've always depended on the assistance of a boot loader application. But as time goes on, this is getting much more difficult. The complexities are expanding. And much more knowledge has to be gathered by the user. My experiences with Grub lately, have been abysmal! Needless to say, it's knocked my attitude down a few notches. Similar to you, I also have separate hard drives for each OS. And my box is also a 64-bit machine. My concern is if you system is a box, and not a laptop, and you physically unplug the plug from the rear of the un-selected drive, those plugs are designed for only a few yanks. It will break on you. And they also become loosely connected with frequent manipulation. If you don't want to use a permanently installed Grub in your system, to select the hard drive(s), perhaps you wouldn't mind using one of those SDG CDROMS. The program can be installed into a floppy, or a USB flash drive, or in a CDROM. Once you've selected your hard drive, the CD can be removed from the disk drive, 'till your next bootup. Or, if you don't need the CD player, then it can stay there.

I was amazed yesterday, when I downloaded SDG, and burned, it, then tried it. It did what I couldn't do! It picked out and made alive any hard drive that I selected. It will do it even if the MBR or Grub is borked. Trouble is, I'm not satisfied until the boot loader will be working as it should be. I don't really want to be tied to an external CDROM for my booting purposed, even though it does an amazing job!

Cheers!
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Re: Sabayon 5.2_64 live disk installation.Brkn.Grub [Solved]

Postby analyticalman » Fri May 28, 2010 7:46

Could you try grub-install /dev/sda rather than /dev/sdb? This works fine for me - I have windows on /dev/sda and Linux distros on /dev/sdb. the bios is set to boot on /dev/sda so thats where you want to write to the MBR. (Alternatively change your boot drive to the B drive in your bios)
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Re: Sabayon 5.2_64 live disk installation.Brkn.Grub [Solved]

Postby Fitzcarraldo » Fri May 28, 2010 12:56

onederer wrote:/drv/sda = Windows; /drv/sdb = PCLOS; /drv/sdc = Sabayon. I did try grub-install /dev/sdb without and with external SABAYON disconnected. I tried it twice! Once as /dev/sdb for the MBR, and the other for /dev/sdb1 for the first partition. No errors are reported. But when I boot up, all I get is "grub rescue>". It just doesn't take! And where it's depositing the results of that command, I have no idea.

The command grub-install /dev/sdb1 installs the Grub Legacy Stage 1 code in the boot sector of the first partition /dev/sdb1. However, the MBR of /dev/sdb is before that partition. So if you already have Grub Legacy Stage 1 code or Grub2 Stage 1 code in the MBR of /dev/sdb then that would run irrespective of what you did to the boot sector of the partition /dev/sdb1 (unless of course you were chainloading from another boot loader directly to /dev/sdb1, that is).

What I think happened when you installed SL 5.2 from the LiveDVD was to install the Grub2 Stage 1 code to the MBR of /dev/sda if that is the primary boot disk. I think the three alternatives I gave in my post Re: Sabayon borked my machine setup. are basically still valid. You need to first fix the MBR of /dev/sda if that is the primary boot disk. Once you have fixed that so that it launches a boot loader (be it the Windows boot loader or the Grub Legacy boot loader or the Grub2 boot loader) then that boot loader could be configured to e.g. chainload the bootloader on /dev/sdb and the bootloader on /dev/sdc.
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Re: Sabayon 5.2_64 live disk installation.Brkn.Grub [Solved]

Postby onederer » Fri May 28, 2010 13:55

Fitzcarraldo wrote:
onederer wrote:/drv/sda = Windows; /drv/sdb = PCLOS; /drv/sdc = Sabayon. I did try grub-install /dev/sdb without and with external SABAYON disconnected. I tried it twice! Once as /dev/sdb for the MBR, and the other for /dev/sdb1 for the first partition. No errors are reported. But when I boot up, all I get is "grub rescue>". It just doesn't take! And where it's depositing the results of that command, I have no idea.

The command grub-install /dev/sdb1 installs the Grub Legacy Stage 1 code in the boot sector of the first partition /dev/sdb1. However, the MBR of /dev/sdb is before that partition. So if you already have Grub Legacy Stage 1 code or Grub2 Stage 1 code in the MBR of /dev/sdb then that would run irrespective of what you did to the boot sector of the partition /dev/sdb1 (unless of course you were chainloading from another boot loader directly to /dev/sdb1, that is).

What I think happened when you installed SL 5.2 from the LiveDVD was to install the Grub2 Stage 1 code to the MBR of /dev/sda if that is the primary boot disk. I think the three alternatives I gave in my post Re: Sabayon borked my machine setup. are basically still valid. You need to first fix the MBR of /dev/sda if that is the primary boot disk. Once you have fixed that so that it launches a boot loader (be it the Windows boot loader or the Grub Legacy boot loader or the Grub2 boot loader) then that boot loader could be configured to e.g. chainload the bootloader on /dev/sdb and the bootloader on /dev/sdc.


Greetings,

The update:

When I chrooted into /dev/sdb, and again "grub-install", this time it told me that "stage1" is corrupt. Before that, I was told that root was missing, but it looked good to me. BTW, PCLOS still uses Grub Classic. External drive's Sabayon, uses Grub2. This time I restored /dev/sda's MBR. So when I boot up now, Windows comes up without the use of any additional bootloader. If I use the Super-Grub-Disk-hybrid-1.98s1, I can select any OS (any hard drive)that I want, with no hassle.

I'm at the point now that I just want to give up. I'm exhausted! I've put in many hours into this, and it's not working out.
I want to experiment with the external USB hard drive adapter, and install different Linux OS's. And that would mean that I'd always have to deal with a new hassle of Grub every time. I have a few 1tb hard drives, and I just plug/unplug them from the adapter (toaster) to swap out the current OS. With the Grub hybrid CDROM, it will eliminate that problem. One temporary Grub on a CDROM, will handle any/all OS's that I plug into this machine. Nothing special need be done, as long as the MBR is intact. Grub can find it, boot it, and run it.

I was working on my next installation, CentOS, when I got badly bit by Sabayon's flaw. I sure hope that on the next update, they will make the installation location of Grub, much more flexible. One size doesn't fit all in this case. The user needs to have the choice as to where Grub can be installed. This machine was running correctly before I got Sabayon. From /dev/sdb, I could select any of the OS's, internally or on a USB connector. I was running DesktopBSD on the external hard drive, before installing Sabayon.

Cheers!
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Re: Sabayon 5.2_64 live disk installation.Brkn.Grub [Solved]

Postby Fitzcarraldo » Fri May 28, 2010 17:53

Just be thankful you haven't got an HDD with a GPT instead of a MBR! GPT is the replacement for MBR. Then you'd really have a headache (Grub2 is supposed to be able to handle GPT HDDs; Grub Legacy doesn't unless it's patched).
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Re: Sabayon 5.2_64 live disk installation.Brkn.Grub [Solved]

Postby onederer » Fri May 28, 2010 23:20

Fitzcarraldo wrote:Just be thankful you haven't got an HDD with a GPT instead of a MBR! GPT is the replacement for MBR. Then you'd really have a headache (Grub2 is supposed to be able to handle GPT HDDs; Grub Legacy doesn't unless it's patched).


(Groan!) Another headache to learn. As if the current applications don't already get us spinning dizzy!

Well, I've made a decision. Considering that I want to use the external hard drive adapter as a test bed for different distros, I think that I better stick with the SGD's hybrid CDROM platter. The reason: because if I install different distros in the external hardrive(s), they all want to install their own version of Grub. That means of having to sort out possible problems every-time, for every new installation, and constant editing of the Grub files. My best solution is using the SGD hybrid CDROM. No Grub need to be installed anywhere. The SGD will pick up any OS that's connected to this machine, even if the MBR is squashed, or the Grub bootloader is corrupt. This in fact, it makes boot-loading, OS neutral. SGD can deal with standard Grub, as well as with Grub2, and now, the new standard you mentioned. Does this reasoning make sense to you? I have one DVD burner, and one CD player. Both (either) will boot-up. I can leave the SGD platter in the lower CD drive, ready for the next re-boot.

Another update: My bug report was rejected. I was told that I didn't know what I was doing. Looks like the changes are not forthcoming. I did ask the developer where is the option to choose where Grub can be installed? Never got a reply on that one. If I would have seen that option, it would have definitely used it. And I wouldn't have gotten into the problem that I have now. I thought that is was a serious enough flaw, but the one who was supposed to fix this, thinks otherwise. The bug report has been closed as "solved"???? :?

Any easy way to fix corrupted Grub's "stage1"? That was the last report that I got, and also, it is now also telling me that root is missing. It will not accept "grub-install".

Cheers!
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