http://blog.vivian-lee.net "distributions-preliminary-round"

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http://blog.vivian-lee.net "distributions-preliminary-round"

Postby Thev00d00 » Tue Aug 11, 2009 12:51

Aww we dont meet the mark apprently:

Sabayon – to tell the truth, I was rather upset Sabayon didn’t meet expectations. Yes, it was absolutely gorgeous. It was fast. It was beautiful. However, its package management system, Entropy, was absolutely atrocious. There is no option during installation to choose which packages you want, and Sabayon insists on installing every package under the sun. The first thing I did with my install was go to Sulfur (GUI frontend) and try to remove all unnecessary packages. After about half an hour of working with a very tedious and clunky interface, I gave up. Why would I waste time installing a distro just to uninstall most of it? I could do it via Equo (CLI), but that doesn’t change the fact that I’d need to uninstall about 300 packages for no good reason.

http://blog.vivian-lee.net/2009/08/linu ... ary-round/

Sounds like he is using an old version to me? :alien:

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Re: http://blog.vivian-lee.net "distributions-preliminary-round"

Postby lxnay » Tue Aug 11, 2009 15:18

Every binary package manager works that way, so this is pretty pointless. You want fine grained package management, you gotta get Portage then.
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Re: http://blog.vivian-lee.net "distributions-preliminary-round"

Postby Stupot » Tue Aug 11, 2009 15:24

"The first thing I did with my install was go to Sulfur (GUI frontend) and try to remove all unnecessary packages."

If that was the first thing he did, then how did he even have Sulfur? Shouldn't he have Spritz until he updates? I smell a rat!

Seriously though, those are very minor things that he tried to blow out of proportion.
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Re: http://blog.vivian-lee.net "distributions-preliminary-round"

Postby vivianlee » Thu Aug 13, 2009 19:23

Hey there. I'm actually the owner of that blog =)

Sounds like he is using an old version to me?

> I'm using Sabayon 4.2 with KDE for amd64. If there's a new version, I'd be happy to take a look if you point me in the right direction.

Every binary package manager works that way, so this is pretty pointless. You want fine grained package management, you gotta get Portage then.

> Arch Linux, sidux, and various others pride themselves on clean-cut and minimalist package installation. I certainly didn't have to go and uninstall a ton of packages when I did my Arch install (which I managed to complete shortly after I made that post). Likewise, my sidux install (at least at the time - not sure how they're doing now) was very simplistic and contained only the bare minimum for the system to run. It was a very pleasant experience.

"The first thing I did with my install was go to Sulfur (GUI frontend) and try to remove all unnecessary packages."
If that was the first thing he did, then how did he even have Sulfur? Shouldn't he have Spritz until he updates? I smell a rat!

> I can reassure you than when my desktop started up directly after installation, I went directly to Sulfur and removed packages. I'm not even familiar with Spritz and surely couldn't have used it.

I just want to clarify that I'm not hating on Sabayon - it is, in fact, THE most beautiful distribution I've ever seen. Your website, in addition, is the best one I've seen for any Linux distro, hands down. I'm kind of picky about my package management systems, though, haha. I'm willing to give Sabayon a try in the future, but I believe that right now it really isn't the distro for me. You guys are doing great things, though (the fact that this is a Gentoo-based distro is already enough to impress me with it's ease of installation).
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Re: http://blog.vivian-lee.net "distributions-preliminary-round"

Postby lxnay » Thu Aug 13, 2009 20:44

If you like Arch, then you'd prefer much more our Sabayon CoreCD version.

Anyway, thanks a lot for the review ;)
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Re: http://blog.vivian-lee.net "distributions-preliminary-round"

Postby vivianlee » Thu Aug 13, 2009 23:44

Ahh, so that's what it is. Maybe I'll give it another whirl sometime (despite being a Debian-user at heart, I find it entertaining to play around with different distros). Thanks!
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Re: http://blog.vivian-lee.net "distributions-preliminary-round"

Postby albfneto » Fri Aug 14, 2009 0:13

No all people are fan of minimalist Distros...!!!
but Sabayon have other versions.... the new Core edition IS MINIMILIST, minimilist as Gentoo..

between the minimalist, i feel Arch, Sidux, but minimilist for minimilist , neither is as good as Gentoo!

two of mine favorite distros, are just Sabayon and Mandriva Free, because of the large number of packages that are installed.

You use OpenSUSE...
New OpenSUSE versions have tons of installed packages, they are not minimilist!
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Re: http://blog.vivian-lee.net "distributions-preliminary-round"

Postby vivianlee » Fri Aug 14, 2009 3:47

I'm not using openSUSE - I am trying openSUSE. I'm going back to Debian or sidux soon for that very reason =)
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Re: http://blog.vivian-lee.net "distributions-preliminary-round"

Postby wolfden » Fri Aug 14, 2009 8:14

vivianlee wrote:Ahh, so that's what it is. Maybe I'll give it another whirl sometime (despite being a Debian-user at heart, I find it entertaining to play around with different distros). Thanks!


This is a general statement, not pointed at anyone, just what i see with reviews. The follow is my own opinion not directed at anyone in paticular

This is why I find reviews useless as most of the time the reviewer doesn't know a thing about the distro. They don't understand the installer or how the package manager works. They compare a mini-dvd install to something like arch linux which doesn't even have that option cause you build it up from scratch. Reviewers can't do that sort of comparison.

We publish release notes for all of our releases and when the release says a gnome desktop or a KDE desktop, yes there is going to be a lot of packages cause we offer a full desktop environment in live mode and install mode. We've been complimented for this feature over and over, especially in areas where people have limited internet. They can order or download one disk and get practically everything they need and show it off to their friends.

We did get a lot of feedback from our users that they wanted a smaller minimal install and so we provided that option with the installer, but it was very time consuming as it had to do a full install and than do the package removing and this is a time consuming process, but can and does work. We than came out with the corecd to help with that issue. Corecd is something one could compare to an arch linux install but is easier as you don't necessarily have to be editing config files. Once CoreCD is loaded you are able to stick with binary or jump into portage for source and if you know what you are doing, you can mix and match. CoreCD is designed for the experience user in mind.

We try to provide and keep our users up to date with knowledge and any current issues through the forum and wiki. We are a bleeding edge distro and run from the ~ arch of gentoo so we expect issues. Issues we see most are Hardware like ATI and Networking and we have to wait for upstream to fix. Many users don't understand that. Many simply think, it don't work so it's our fault. Sometimes it is, no doubt about it and we will get a fix out to our users.

So for a reviewer to do a decent job of a review, they have to really do their homework. I can't give a review as I am biased. Anyone can stick in 100 linux livecds in their machine and say, well this one sucked, this one is best, but they have no idea how or why it is. If you know how and why, the distro that sucked might have a simple command to run and suddenly it's the best distro. How does one know all the options available without knowing the distro? Knowing the history helps a lot also, what is it based on and stuff like that.

Is a first impression important? sure it is and we try hard to provide that and with feedback, we change things for the better. It just kinda frustrating to see a bad review from a reviewer when it's so obvious they just don't know what they are doing. I guess everyone is entitle to say their peace, I just wish people would try more and not compare apples to grapes.

End of my general opinion not directed at anyone in paticular.
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