Amarok Beta in sabayon-weekly

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Amarok Beta in sabayon-weekly

Postby Provia » Sun Jan 27, 2013 18:50

Today i've noticed that the version present in both sabayonlinux.org and sabayon weekly is 2.6.90. I'm not complaining about problems with this package but i can't understand why force users to update a software from a stable release to a beta release.
Anyone knows something about this choice?
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Re: Amarok Beta in sabayon-weekly

Postby sabayonino » Sun Jan 27, 2013 19:12

Sabayon has an "unstable" profile. (see accept_keywords in make.conf).

In portage Amarok "Stable" is 2.5.0-r4

The weekly repository is updated once a week but the packages are the same if they don't receive an update version.
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Re: Amarok Beta in sabayon-weekly

Postby Provia » Sun Jan 27, 2013 20:56

In my opinion is a bad idea to include a beta package in stable repos(sabayonlinux.org and sabayon-weekly). Furthermore we are talking about a package that has already reached the stable version 2.7.0.
I don't want to do a sterile polemic but including beta software in stable repos is in most cases is a risk.
We have new features before (in most cases we have to wait only 1 or 2 week more) but we get a higher probability of bugged software.
I'm not complaining for a mine problem i'm just thinking about normal users. Why give them unstable updates?

Sabayon is a Linux distribution.
We aim to deliver the best user experience "out of the box" by providing the latest open source technologies in an elegant format.
In Sabayon everything should just work. We offer a bleeding edge operating system that is both stable and reliable


As said before i love updates and last version of software but i can easily wait some days for the stable final version(debian testing follow this idea).
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Re: Amarok Beta in sabayon-weekly

Postby sabayonino » Sun Jan 27, 2013 21:06

As I wrote SL was compiled with "unstable/testing" profile . see original make.conf

here nothing is "stable".

Please see Sabayon Wiki

What is Sabayon Linux based on?

Sabayon Linux is based on, and emanates substantially from, Gentoo GNU/Linux(Gentoo testing). Gentoo Linux is one of the most popular source-based Linux distributions. As Ubuntu uses some of the packages from Debian, so Sabayon recieves its packages from Gentoo. In particular, Sabayon is based on Gentoo's testing branch. Gentoo's testing branch is about on par with Debian's Sid (unstable branch) releases. Though based on the bleeding edge, you will find Sabayon is quite stable and perhaps more cutting edge. Both Sabayon and Gentoo are on rolling release cycle, but Sabayon will have release snapshots.

Sabayon when using the package manager Entropy is binary based. (currently Sabayon has about 10,000 packages in Entropy)

Sabayon when using the package manager Portage is source based. (the Gentoo repo is quite huge)
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Re: Amarok Beta in sabayon-weekly

Postby Provia » Sun Jan 27, 2013 21:19

Ok thanks! Now it's more clear as i never tried gentoo. So that case the problem is that amarok was automatically complied from gentoo testing and put in sabayon limbo and then "stable" entropy repos. The question is: "why nobody stops it before it was put in stable entropy?"
I have the feeling, maybe i'm wrong, that packages pass from repo to repo automatically without being tested or stopped in case of problems.
Can you explain it to me if i have not understood?
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Re: Amarok Beta in sabayon-weekly

Postby Stupot » Sun Jan 27, 2013 23:13

Yes.

When a package is first compiled it goes to to the Sabayon-limbo repository to be tested out by testers. When there are no complaints and everything seems to be working right, it then gets pushed out to the standard Sabayonlinux.org repo. Once a week, the Sabayon.org packages are pushed out to Sabayon-weekly.

The hope is that every problem is noticed in sabayon-limbo before it ever reaches a normal user. If it reaches normal users using the sabayonlinux.org, then hopefully it can be fixed/reverted before hitting the sabayon-weekly.

There are multiple chances for a package to be tested/held back/reverted before hitting sabayon-weekly.

But, regardless of that entire process, Sabayon is based on gentoo unstable/testing profile. Beta software that doesn't prove to be problematic will be pushed out to normal users. This should be expected and it will not be changing.
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Re: Amarok Beta in sabayon-weekly

Postby sabayonino » Sun Jan 27, 2013 23:24

Provia wrote:I have the feeling, maybe i'm wrong, that packages pass from repo to repo automatically without being tested or stopped in case of problems.
Can you explain it to me if i have not understood?


Sabayon-Limbo : The new packages/features are testing here (as much possible)
if testers don't reported any problems , packages are pushed in sabayonlinux.org

sabayonlinux.org : is the main repository. : after a week all packages are pushed in sabayon-weekly

sabayon-weekly : all packages should be tested sufficiently ; but unfortunately sometimes you may encounter problems that did not reported n "limbo" or "sabayonlinux.org"
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Re: Amarok Beta in sabayon-weekly

Postby Provia » Mon Jan 28, 2013 0:15

sabayonino wrote:
Sabayon-Limbo : The new packages/features are testing here (as much possible)
if testers don't reported any problems , packages are pushed in sabayonlinux.org

sabayonlinux.org : is the main repository. : after a week all packages are pushed in sabayon-weekly

sabayon-weekly : all packages should be tested sufficiently ; but unfortunately sometimes you may encounter problems that did not reported n "limbo" or "sabayonlinux.org"


Sorry i was not clear. i know that. But what i mean is that beta packages that gets compiled automatically from gentoo testing must be not allowed to enter in sabayonlinux.org(obviously that's my opinion). My doubt is that maybe there are not enought testers and this package was simply automatically moved to stable repos without any feedback.
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Re: Amarok Beta in sabayon-weekly

Postby sabayonino » Mon Jan 28, 2013 0:29

portage also provides the 2.5.0-r4 (Stable Version for Gentoo) version.

Code: Select all
media-sound/amarok
     Available versions:  (4) 2.5.0-r4^t (~)2.6.0^t (~)2.7.0
        {cdda daap debug +embedded ipod lastfm mp3tunes mtp ofa opengl semantic-desktop test +utils LINGUAS="af ar ast be bg bs ca [email protected] cs csb da de el en_GB eo es et eu fa fi fr ga gl he hr hu is it ja km ko ku lt lv mai ml ms nb nds ne nl nn oc pa pl pt pt_BR ro ru se si sk sl sq sr [email protected] [email protected] [email protected] [email protected] sv tg th tr ug uk wa zh_CN zh_TW"}
     Homepage:            http://amarok.kde.org/
     Description:         Advanced audio player based on KDE framework.


You can compile this if you want.
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Re: Amarok Beta in sabayon-weekly

Postby Stupot » Mon Jan 28, 2013 4:38

Provia wrote:Sorry i was not clear. i know that. But what i mean is that beta packages that gets compiled automatically from gentoo testing must be not allowed to enter in sabayonlinux.org(obviously that's my opinion). My doubt is that maybe there are not enought testers and this package was simply automatically moved to stable repos without any feedback.


That is the way it is and the way it will stay. You probably underestimate just how many beta or "unstable" packages that are a part of the repository. Sabayon doesn't have a beta-repo and a stable-repo. The effort to maintain such a thing is more than what the developers can manage.

If there were enough support, it certainly could be done, but there simply isn't. That is the wonderful thing about open source though. If enough people want something, some of them will be motivated enough to actually do it.
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