Hello Sabayon, goodbye Kubuntu

Discussion in general that pertains to Sabayon Linux - Must Pertain to Sabayon Linux

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RaNDyMyZe
Baby Hen
Posts: 5
Joined: Tue Feb 20, 2007 2:35
Location: Pacific Northwest US

Post by RaNDyMyZe » Fri Feb 23, 2007 19:47

Mike wrote:
RaNDyMyZe wrote: 3. There is a really uncomfortable feeling some people get handing over package management to a commercial third party utility. While the code is open source and there is supposed to be a section of free software it definately has ties to commercial software sales. I know I'm not yet very comfortable handing over package management or letting CNR interfere with or get mixed up in portage or apt.

The last point is my personal beef with the idea. I like that it could strengthen installing Linux boxes here at work for public use. I use Kubuntu here at work and Sabayon at home. Package management can be fragile enough with good practices and I don't trust CNR not to break things.
You write as though package management is a complicated task, I guess it is if your threaten by multistep tasks but it is not something super hard to code.
When portage is controlling the package management there isn't another application to interfere. In Debian there are several front ends for dpkg. First there is apt. Then you can use apt-get or aptitude as front ends for apt because both of them have useful functions to them. It's a really good idea to only have one utility managing the package repository. The more apps that have there fingers in the package list the more likely you are to get broken or orphaned packages. It's not even a good idea to consistently use aptitude and apt-get together as they can fight with each other. Adding CNR into the mix is only likely to cause more dpkg breakage and I couldn't even see it mixing with portage at all.

I think you are definitely oversimplifying the overall ease of package management in Linux. One doesn't have to be threatened by package management to know that it's delicate and easily broken by someone who doesn't know what they're doing. Portage is simple in many ways but it's easy to break your application if you don't know what you're doing. The same with dpkg.

Jesterhead
Old Dear Hen
Posts: 642
Joined: Thu Dec 14, 2006 14:13

Post by Jesterhead » Fri Feb 23, 2007 19:57

Well, about CNR:

In how many Countries can you 100% legally view Multimedia stuff with FLOSS?

So the way Linspire goes is the right way, even other Distribution go the same way (Mandriva for example, they also ship LinDVD for example).

frogimus
Growing Hen
Posts: 113
Joined: Thu Jan 04, 2007 11:26

Post by frogimus » Fri Feb 23, 2007 20:28

Linspire :puke:

Jesterhead
Old Dear Hen
Posts: 642
Joined: Thu Dec 14, 2006 14:13

Post by Jesterhead » Fri Feb 23, 2007 20:48

Sure, the Distribution itself is questionable ;)
Basically like an incest child of PCLinuxOS and Ubuntu hehe

But i think that some approaches of Linspire itself arent that bad, because providing optional (!) closed programs and stuff through the package System is the best way imho.

Nice examples are Crossoffice, Cedega, Multimedia Stuff, there are also Games which you must pay for.

Wel. Gentoo does the same basically (if you provide portage the needed files which you mst have purchased).

frogimus
Growing Hen
Posts: 113
Joined: Thu Jan 04, 2007 11:26

Post by frogimus » Fri Feb 23, 2007 21:04

Bill Gates made Linspire to make Linux look bad.

Not really, but if you ever load it, you'll think so too....

Mike
Young Hen
Posts: 33
Joined: Sun Feb 11, 2007 3:20

Post by Mike » Fri Feb 23, 2007 21:41

RaNDyMyZe wrote:
Mike wrote:
RaNDyMyZe wrote: 3. There is a really uncomfortable feeling some people get handing over package management to a commercial third party utility. While the code is open source and there is supposed to be a section of free software it definately has ties to commercial software sales. I know I'm not yet very comfortable handing over package management or letting CNR interfere with or get mixed up in portage or apt.

The last point is my personal beef with the idea. I like that it could strengthen installing Linux boxes here at work for public use. I use Kubuntu here at work and Sabayon at home. Package management can be fragile enough with good practices and I don't trust CNR not to break things.
You write as though package management is a complicated task, I guess it is if your threaten by multistep tasks but it is not something super hard to code.
When portage is controlling the package management there isn't another application to interfere. In Debian there are several front ends for dpkg. First there is apt. Then you can use apt-get or aptitude as front ends for apt because both of them have useful functions to them. It's a really good idea to only have one utility managing the package repository. The more apps that have there fingers in the package list the more likely you are to get broken or orphaned packages. It's not even a good idea to consistently use aptitude and apt-get together as they can fight with each other. Adding CNR into the mix is only likely to cause more dpkg breakage and I couldn't even see it mixing with portage at all.

I think you are definitely oversimplifying the overall ease of package management in Linux. One doesn't have to be threatened by package management to know that it's delicate and easily broken by someone who doesn't know what they're doing. Portage is simple in many ways but it's easy to break your application if you don't know what you're doing. The same with dpkg.
It's stupid to argue whos opinion is true, I'll just stop now.

bigj2632
Baby Hen
Posts: 18
Joined: Sat Feb 10, 2007 20:21
Location: College Station, Tx

Post by bigj2632 » Fri Feb 23, 2007 22:03

CNR ISNT ALL THAT BAD IT HELPS BRING NEW PEOPLE TO LINUX WHO DONT HAVE THE TIME TO SIT AT A COMPUTER ALL DAY AS LONG AS MORE PEOPLE ARE USING LINUX OVER MICROSOFT I REALLY DONT CARE WHAT DISTRO THERE USING TO DO IT

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